The Quran's Sura 19-"The Spider"

[SrWoodchuck]

http://wintersoldier2008.typepad.com/summer_patriot_winter_sol/:

September 06, 2011


What about these passages, islamic rage boy?

sura 29 is entitled "the spider," and it contains many interesting verses.

but, for my purposes, those verses of most interest establish that it is islamic doctrine & belief, straight from god through gabriel through mohammed, that the scriptures of the torah and the gospels are binding upon muslims just as and in the same manner as those scriptures revealed by mohammed.

it is written.

thus.--

14. we sent noah out to his people. ... we saved him and those with him on the ark. we made this a sign for all people.

16. we also sent abraham. he said to his people, "serve god and be mindful of him: that is better for you, if only you knew. 17. what you worship instead of god are mere idols; what you invent is nothing but falsehood. ...."

28. and [we sent] lot. he said to his people, "you practice outrageous acts that no people before you have ever committed. 29. how can you lust after men, waylay travellers, and commit evil in your gatherings?"

39. [remember] qarun and pharaoh and haman: mses brought them clear signs, but they behaved arrogantly on earth. they could not escape us 40. and we punished each one of them for their sins: ... ."

45. [prophet], recite what has been revealed to you of the scripture; keep up the prayer: prayer restrains outrageous and unacceptable behavior. remembering god is greater: god knows everything you are doing. 46. [believers], argue only in the best way with the people of the book, except with those of them who act unjustly. say, "we believe in what was revealed to us and in what was revealed to you; our god and your god is one [and the same]; we are devoted to him."

47. his is the way we sent the scripture to you [muhammed]. those to whom we had already given scripture believe in [the qur'an] and so do some of these people. no one refuses to acknowledge our revelations but the defiant.

51. do they not think it is enough that we have sent down to you the scripture that is recited to them? there is a mercy in this and a lesson for believing people. 52. say, "god is sufficient witness between me and you: he knows what is in the heavens and earth. those who believe in false deities and deny god will be the losers."

sura 29, "the spider," verses 14-52 [not inclusive], the qur'an, a translation by muhammad a.s. abdel haleem, oxford university press, 2004, u.s.a., pages 253-55.

those who believe in the logic and message of grammar will please note that in these passages god's message is referred to as "scripture," and not "scriptures." in these passages of the koran the scripture, the truth of things, is one body of work, the same as revealed by earlier prophets to jews and christians, and the same as revealed by mohammed.

the scriptures revealed by mohammed are the same as earlier scripture, and the scripture revealed to islam is the same as previous scripture.

it is one body of work.

and, note one startling assertion, ... , and that is god's instruction to mohammed, telling him to tell the people, "say, [prophet], "god is sufficient witness between me [god] and you [e.g., believing people]: he knows what is in the heavens and earth.

this is the koran speaking.

it is not 1400 years of interpretation, institutionalization, bureaucratization serving the interests of a political leviathan. and, notice something else. god is speaking not only of people who believe in scripture as revealed by mohammed, but also of believing people who believe in scripture as revealed by noah, by abraham, by isaac & jacob, by moses, by john the baptist and by the other prophets of the torah, and of the gospels.

......god is sufficient witness of the observance of that which is commanded. i read nothing in these passages about imams and ayatollahs. only about god, his instruction in the scripture, and the sufficiency of his witness of the same.

that's what the koran says. after all is said and done.

john jay @ 09.05.2011

[Sanguine]

I'm not sure I understand the writer's point. I have read the quran, and it is not consistent with the Bible.

[SrWoodchuck]

Sanguine!

 

My understanding is that the writer is commenting on the particular Sura 19 [known as "the spider"- for whatever reason....and he's saying that the Quran says that "scripture" as given to the Jews or to Muslims [who believe that the angel Gabriel gave the Quran to Mohammad, directly from the "one God"- in their case Allah] is the same, and only to be judged by God, as the sole arbiter.....and not man [including the later hadiths & sura's written during Mohammads time & after.] All were given God's message....and those that pervert that message....risk God's wrath.