Disturbing Similarities Between the Fall of Rome and Today’s America

[Geee]

Pajamas Media:

My specialty is American history, but graduate school forces you to learn other branches of history as well, so it was not any great struggle to teach Western civilization. Still, when I do teach a class outside my concentration, I spend some time reading recent scholarship as well. If a student asks a question beyond what the textbook covers, it helps to be sufficiently well read in the field not to look stupid!

The debates at the Philadelphia Convention, and the war of pamphlets concerning ratification of the Constitution, make frequent reference to the problem of how and why republics die — and Rome was certainly one of the more common examples. One of the arguments against replacing the Articles of Confederation with an all-powerful national government was that republics on such a vast scale in people and area were impractical — and Rome was regarded as an example of this. Hence, our Constitution created a national government of limited powers. (And then it evolved, rather like an iguana turning into T. rex.)

Some of my recent background reading includes Christopher S. Mackay’s The Breakdown of the Roman Republic: From Oligarchy to Empire (2009). The introduction includes a description of what the Roman historian Sallust, writing The Catilinarian Conspiracy in the 30s BC, saw as the cause of the fall. The Roman republic had successfully defeated its only real serious mortal threat, Carthage, in the Punic Wars, but now:

Peace and wealth — things that are otherwise desirable — were an oppressive cause of misery for those who had easily endured hard work and danger and events both doubtful and dire. For this reason, there grew a greed first for money and then for rule, and these were like the raw material for all evils. For avarice overthrew good faith, honesty and all the other virtues, and in place of them it taught arrogance, cruelty, neglect of the gods, and the notion that everything is for sale. Self-serving ambition forced many men to become false,… to consider their friendships and enmities not on the basis of fact but of advantage, and to keep their countenance good rather than their character.

[Valin]

Or not

[Pepper]

Valin Geee

 

Just a few slight adjustments to this list of Major Causes for the Fall of the Roman Empire

 

Not much needed to be changed.

 

 

 

The Major Causes for the Fall of the Roman American Empire

 

Antagonism between the Senate and the Emperor

Decline in Morals

Political Corruption and the Praetorian Guard White House Czars

Fast expansion of the Empire into private sector

Constant Wars and Heavy Military Spending due to clueless CIC

Barbarian Knowledge of Roman US Military Tactics

Failing Economy

Unemployment of the Working Classes (The Plebs)

The 'Mob' and the cost of the 'Games'

Decline in Ethics and Values

Slave Uncontrolled borderLabor

Natural Disasters

Disrespect for Founding Principles and Judeo-Christianity

Barbarian Invasion

Excessive life style by the Emperor and Family

[righteousmomma]

Good list pepper.

 

Total breakdown of the family and rampant legalized houses of homosexual activity can be added to the list too.

 

And EDITED to add suspected lead poisoning didn't help the mental state.

 

It is odd how history tends to repeat itself. Least we all have read the end of The Book.

[Pepper]

RighteousMomma

 

Yes. Good point.

 

 

The second item on the list covers part of that breakdown of family: Decline in Morals

[NCTexan]

Total breakdown of the family...

This is largely due to liberal government programs that result in the abdication of individual responsibility.

 

While the turning away from God and traditional values has affected all segments of our population... the effect is most dramatic on those segments that have become most dependent and affected by the Nanny socialist state... and takes away all sense of personal responsibility for key aspects of their life including family.

 

Due to his race, we now have a president who was positioned to actually address these segments like no president ever before.

 

He's had so many times to talk straight and tough like Bill Cosby had done. But no...

 

We have a president who uses his weekly address to focus on National Women's Equality Month, has public signings of the Japanese Book of Condolences, hosts endless events to honor sports or music icons, and never misses a chance to play a race card that paints blacks as nothing more than helpless victims in need of a prescient liberal government to nurture them.

 

This president is as devastating to a nation as any failed Roman Caesar. JMO

 

[righteousmomma]

RighteousMomma

 

Yes. Good point.

 

 

The second item on the list covers part of that breakdown of family: Decline in Morals

Well, bro/cousin not to get technical but the Roman society was really amoral.

 

We look at morality from a Judeo/Christian viewpoint. This was not the case with Greece or Rome.

 

At one point in history (and I refuse to look at wiki to refresh my mind and be smart)the Roman government ordered that a room be put in some building in Rome (the Senate?) Can't recall. Anyway it was for state sanctioned liaisons because so many married men were carrying on with other men that the family was threatened. So this preventative measure was the solution. Guess it was the forerunner of the noon quickie.

(Don't get me started on idol temple prostitution)

 

Anyhoo it was not until Constantine - some 350 years after Christianity was founded- instituted our "Christian" morality that we see real Western morality begin. (If I might say about Constantine --instituting Christianity was the worse thing he could have done and yet God used it for good.)

 

By then though Rome as the world power was in decline. To put things in perspective yesterday we celebrated St. Patrick's Day. He was born somewhere between 350- 400 AD in pagan, Druid sacrificing and worshiping Britain. Some how he heard the gospel while in slavery in Ireland and became a convert to Christianity AND ONE of God's greatest witnesses.

 

See, now isn't this fun? We lockstepped alpacaans family inbreeds are having an actual discussion.

[righteousmomma]

Total breakdown of the family...

This is largely due to liberal government programs that result in the abdication of individual responsibility.

 

While the turning away from God and traditional values has affected all segments of our population... the effect is most dramatic on those segments that have become most dependent and affected by the Nanny socialist state... and takes away all sense of personal responsibility for key aspects of their life including family.

 

Due to his race, we now have a president who was positioned to actually address these segments like no president ever before.

 

He's had so many times to talk straight and tough like Bill Cosby had done. But no...

 

We have a president who uses his weekly address to focus on National Women's Equality Month, has public signings of the Japanese Book of Condolences, hosts endless events to honor sports or music icons, and never misses a chance to play a race card that paints blacks as nothing more than helpless victims in need of a prescient liberal government to nurture them.

 

This president is as devastating to a nation as any failed Roman Caesar. JMO

 

 

Yes, dear --and he sat and dined with a black liberation minister (whom he was deaf to, never heard) who preaches the evils of capitalism and the virtues of socialism and even uses poor ole Micah the prophet as his colleague in this distortion and perversion of God's word. (MY opinion)

[NCJim]

I have been hearing this since the 6th grade....

[Sabre86]

Fine, whatever.

 

Clearly a consensus has been reached already and my opinion isn't welcome.

Edited March 19, 2011 by Sabre86

[righteousmomma]

Well, as an art education major I would say that the expanding borders concept has not much to do with the deterioration of Rome. Far more likely that all the previous lists were in play. JMArtEdOpinion.

 

As far as us being doomed. We are if the O gets a second term. If not , only our God knows our future.

Edited March 19, 2011 by righteousmomma
Reason

[pollyannaish]

Great discussion and its very interesting.

 

I'm not ready yet to cede that we are watching the fall of our country. I do think we are struggling, but 'd like to see us keep working on saving it.

 

Nations rise and fall over time for many complex reasons and nothing is guaranteed. Some fall and disappear spectacularly and others simply decline. A country takes hits from national disasters and from internal threats.

 

We probably have less control over this than we like. But we can do our best to keep our own houses in order and take responsibility for our own lives. That's probably our best counter measure. On this point, Glenn Beck is correct.