The Fatal Fallacy of Muslim Outreach

[Geee]

American Thinker:

When the government engages in "Muslim Outreach," what are its objectives? To make us safe? To undermine the vicious ideology that commands our conquest, subjugation, and oppression? Or to appease and capitulate to these supremacist groups? Clearly it is the last, and the consequences of such foolhardy and delusional efforts render us less safe, as in the case of the Boston Marathon jihad bombers, Tamerlan and Dzhokhar Tsarnaev.

Those devout Muslims in Boston designed bombs to tear through the flesh and bone of babies, mothers, and families, and only a couple of brave politicians have shown interest in the motive. Is that what we have become as a nation? A people?

The Boston bombers have said they slaughtered Americans in the cause of Islam.

Yet it was only Representative Louis Gohmert (R-TX) who has shown any interest in the implications of this. Gohmert is a hero, a singular man of courage. He pressed FBI director Robert Mueller last month until finally Mueller admitted that the only contact that the FBI had with the Boston bombers' terror mosque was "outreach."

Outreach is a euphemism for submission. With the Boston jihad bombings, the mosquerade of "outreach" achieved its goal of deceiving and "subduing" the dhimmi FBI. Americans were murdered in cold blood, but the FBI's "outreach" with the terror mosque was successful.

[Valin]

@Geee

 

What we see here is the usual...(well) simplistic drivel (Islam/Muslims are totally evil...oh and of course Obama is a secret Muslim) from the like of Pamela Gellar, Robert Spencer, Andrew Bostom...etc. One might almost suspect given the fact they never have anything positive to say about Islam or Muslims.

 

This is why I much prefer people like, Daniel Pipes.

[righteousmomma]

I think that in this article Gellar makes some excellent points. There are many parallels I could make but will not.

I do not sense that she is condemning all Muslims as evil but trying to wake everyone up.

 

At the heart of everything is one's worldview and perspective on Who God is or - who he is not.

 

Have any of you noticed how most liberal/progressives are very liberal in their faith orientation. Have you noticed how the vast majority will say they believe in "God" . A universal Creative force who is all love and acceptance of any and everything which leaves them with absolutely no accountability for their individual lives. That the Bible is a book of myths,legends and folklore; that it was written in the sense of man reaching for a God that suited his need for excuses and crutches in life and that today we are an enlightened scientific society that proclaims those who do have an "evangelical faith" as ignorant, bigoted, delusional - even racist haters. That the teachings of Jesus are only seen as social ethics in which somehow we humans need to save the planet and set all the world's suffering masses free from oppression and bondage by Jesus' example of being a " suffering savior" and a stellar human being who knew his Jewish law. You know kind of like Marxist liberation theology.

 

All I guess I am saying- again and again - each of us needs to have the Big Picture - past, present and future - and to remember.

[Geee]

I think that in this article Gellar makes some excellent points. There are many parallels I could make but will not.

I do not sense that she is condemning all Muslims as evil but trying to wake everyone up.

 

At the heart of everything is one's worldview and perspective on Who God is or - who he is not.

 

Have any of you noticed how most liberal/progressives are very liberal in their faith orientation. Have you noticed how the vast majority will say they believe in "God" . A universal Creative force who is all love and acceptance of any and everything which leaves them with absolutely no accountability for their individual lives. That the Bible is a book of myths,legends and folklore; that it was written in the sense of man reaching for a God that suited his need for excuses and crutches in life and that today we are an enlightened scientific society that proclaims those who do have an "evangelical faith" as ignorant, bigoted, delusional - even racist haters. That the teachings of Jesus are only seen as social ethics in which somehow we humans need to save the planet and set all the world's suffering masses free from oppression and bondage by Jesus' example of being a " suffering savior" and a stellar human being who knew his Jewish law. You know kind of like Marxist liberation theology.

 

All I guess I am saying- again and again - each of us needs to have the Big Picture - past, present and future - and to remember.

 

You have described my Lib-Sis to a tee.

[Valin]

 

I think that in this article Gellar makes some excellent points. There are many parallels I could make but will not.

I do not sense that she is condemning all Muslims as evil but trying to wake everyone up.

 

At the heart of everything is one's worldview and perspective on Who God is or - who he is not.

 

Have any of you noticed how most liberal/progressives are very liberal in their faith orientation. Have you noticed how the vast majority will say they believe in "God" . A universal Creative force who is all love and acceptance of any and everything which leaves them with absolutely no accountability for their individual lives. That the Bible is a book of myths,legends and folklore; that it was written in the sense of man reaching for a God that suited his need for excuses and crutches in life and that today we are an enlightened scientific society that proclaims those who do have an "evangelical faith" as ignorant, bigoted, delusional - even racist haters. That the teachings of Jesus are only seen as social ethics in which somehow we humans need to save the planet and set all the world's suffering masses free from oppression and bondage by Jesus' example of being a " suffering savior" and a stellar human being who knew his Jewish law. You know kind of like Marxist liberation theology.

 

All I guess I am saying- again and again - each of us needs to have the Big Picture - past, present and future - and to remember.

You have described my Lib-Sis to a tee.

 

 

In other words God is a "Progressive". God is not a Right Wing Republican, God is not a Left Wing Democrat, God Is. Period....next paragraph.

Here is something it appears they don't understand. Yes God will forgive you of your sins, but you still have to pay the consequences for your actions. God forgave Chuck Colson....but he still had to do the time. If you are a junkie and a believer, bad things are still going to happen to you. This is the way God made this world. There is a reason why God gave us these rules, and it wasn't just because God felt like it. Sleep around...bad things will happen, step off the top of a 20 story building...bad things will happen. Because that's the way the world works.

/preaching to the choir.

[righteousmomma]

Geee, every liberal I know falls into that category for the most part. Though there are a few I know personally who really believe but lean toward the left or Democrat side when voting. I guess they will fall under the progressive Christian label that Valin has alerted us to.

Valin,

 

In other words God is a "Progressive". God is not a Right Wing Republican, God is not a Left Wing Democrat, God Is. Period....next paragraph.

 

I had no idea there is "progressive Christianity" until you mentioned it.

 

Progressive Christianity
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Progressive Christianity is the name given to a movement within contemporary Christianity characterized by willingness to question tradition, acceptance of human diversity with a strong emphasis on social justice or care for the poor and the oppressed (often identified as minority groups) and environmental stewardship of the Earth. Progressive Christians have a deep belief in the centrality of the instruction to "love one another" (John 15:17) within the teaching of Jesus Christ.[1] This leads to a focus on compassion, promoting justice and mercy, tolerance, and working towards solving the societal problems of poverty, discrimination and environmental issues, especially by social and political activism. Comparatively, a further understanding within Christianity being of the Greek word agape or agapaó as used within John 15:17 translated to the English word "love" as that being of "i.e. embracing God's will (choosing His choices) and obeying them through His power".[2]

This movement is by no means the only significant movement of progressive thought among Christians (see the 'See also' links below), but it is currently a focus of such issues in many parts of the world.

Progressive Christianity draws on the insights of multiple theological streams including: 19th century evangelicalism, 19th and early 20th century Christian liberalism, 20th century neo-orthodoxy, and late 20th and 21st century liberation theology.[3] The characteristics of Progressive Christianity, and its distinction from Liberal Christianity, have been articulated in an article[4] by Hal Taussig. These can be summarized as:

A spiritual vitality and expressiveness, including participatory, arts-infused, and lively worship as well as a variety of spiritual rituals and practices such as meditation
Intellectual integrity including a willingness to question
An affirmation of human diversity
An affirmation of the Christian faith with a simultaneous sincere respect for other faiths
Strong ecological concerns and commitments

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Progressive_Christianity

[Chickadee]

Recently in the very conservative evangelical denomination we adhere to, there has been a group pushing themselves forward. And they are indeed calling themselves 'progressives.' This group, worldwide but not yet truly organized, are strongly voicing their desire to change a number of the basic precepts of our church structure. The description above about progressive Christians fits this group exactly. The current hot topics have to do with women's ordination and acceptance of homosexuals--it's all about tolerance. The church has long been known for work with the poor, disaster relief, the homeless and prison ministries, but that does not seem to be enough to satisfy the progressives. It has been an interesting dialog. We are distressed that this faction might divide the church and weaken it--just as we have seen the 'progressive' movement seek to weaken the very fabric of our United States constitution.

[righteousmomma]

Chickadee, just occurred to me - from your post - and the wiki description of progressive Christianity that this sounds a lot like the "emerging church" movement which I wrote about here quite a while back. On the surface the motives and goals sound fine - and mostly probably are with the best of intentions- but some of the wording and stances began to alert my radar acouple years back. Some very well known leaders/pastors/writers are involved. Though some are beginning to distance themselves from what I have read.

[Chickadee]

Chickadee, just occurred to me - from your post - and the wiki description of progressive Christianity that this sounds a lot like the "emerging church" movement which I wrote about here quite a while back. On the surface the motives and goals sound fine - and mostly probably are with the best of intentions- but some of the wording and stances began to alert my radar acouple years back. Some very well known leaders/pastors/writers are involved. Though some are beginning to distance themselves from what I have read.

Yes, I remember when you wrote about that. I'm glad to hear some are pulling back. I am against the dumbing down of beliefs, and I believe this is in our religious beliefs as well as our political beliefs. It also applies, IMO, to educational standards.

[Geee]

@righteousmomma- acceptance of 'anything and everything' except Republicans you mean. Baby murders, pedophiles, etc etc can all be forgiven. Conservatives are the devil. If someone that you know is NOT to be devil is a conservative, what is the explanation. They just uneducated or mis-informed,mis-led etc.

[SrWoodchuck]

@Geee

 

What we see here is the usual...(well) simplistic drivel (Islam/Muslims are totally evil...oh and of course Obama is a secret Muslim) from the like of Pamela Gellar, Robert Spencer, Andrew Bostom...etc. One might almost suspect given the fact they never have anything positive to say about Islam or Muslims.

 

This is why I much prefer people like, Daniel Pipes.

 

Disagree completely with you, @Valin.

 

Sometimes you have to make a choice....and as I see it....a religion, where the very name means my submission to it...is where I draw my line.

 

Tired of your arguments against Gellar & Spencer. Don't believe in your bias & I firmly reject your reasons.

 

There is no nuance in Islam.....except in the Muslim dual interpretation of their own dictates.

 

 

 

 

 

There are real savages in this world....and these are some of the most bloodthirsty. These pics are from the great multi-culti experiment in England. The destruction to America, from this group of religious zealots....that drag the whole silent majority of Islam with it as it returns to 7th Century horror [because there are no 'moderate' Muslim leaders.....only those with their eyes on a Caliphate.....and those too cowed to peep....also known as apostates, if they do peep] will rival the destruction of Detroit & Chicago, by liberal policies.

 

They are misogynistic, bigoted & assimilation is anathema to them.

 

They have infiltrated & corrupted our own federal government......and are doing the same to the UK, France, Sweden & other parts of Europe.....by design & with the intent to overthrow & destroy western civilization. They are a fascist plague on freedom.

 

You can go ahead & mollify & poo-poo the few brave people who speak up & reject their plan, but I'm not going to....ever. .[/rant]

[Valin]

@SrWoodchuck

 

I am in the minority on this on The right. Being in the minority does not mean I am wrong.

 

I refer you to Daniel Pipes: Islam and Again Daniel Pipes Darn near anything be Bernard Lewis in particular "Faith and Power Religion and Politics in the Middle East", Walid Phares and his Future Jihad trilogy, and "The Coming Revolution the struggle for freedom in the Middle east, The End of Islamism? Frank Gaffney, Steve Emerson,...more if you want.

 

I'll see your The usual suspects and raise you these

 

 

 

I will give Spencer etal credit, they are masters at marketing their message. Simplistic messages are always the easiest to sell. Now say what they say is true and Islam is the Problem, and by inference Muslims are the problem. what does that mean and what actions does that lead us too take? (I'll give you a hint Nuke Mecca). I would take their view more seriously if they ever said or wrote anything positive about Islam, they don't because their audience would not stand for it.

 

As I have said before. We see today two different views one mainly on the Left pushed by the likes of John Esposito, Maria Menocal, which basically says "Problem? There's no real problem, other than a few "Extremists" living on the edge of of Muslim society, and what problems there are, are mainly our fault. On the Right we see Spencer etal, which basically says "All (real) Muslims hate us and want to kill us Nuke Mecca. Who exactly died and put them in charge of decidin. who is and who isn't a Real Muslim, I have no idea. They for some unknown reason buy into the Wahhabists view of who is a Real Muslim. And that is the problem. Also both side provide aid to our enemies one by pretending nothing is going on, and the other by feed the Jihadi meme...The West is at war with Islam.

 

Both side are wrong...wrong...wrong and for the same reasons A simplistic view of history and Islam. We are smack dab in the middle of a civil war inside Islam, the question being asked is (still) what happened and how do we fix it. One of two things is going to happen in the next 100(?) years. Islam will come to grips with the modern world change it fit in leave the desert behind or it will go away, become like the neo pagans are today.

 

So feel free to disagree, and I will continue to take you and others to task. Because call me crazy but I'd kind of like to win this thing, and going to war with 1.5 Billion people seems to me do be awfully dumb. But hey, that's just me.

[Pepper]

@Valin @SrWoodchuck

 

I agree on the surface with your statement that "going to war with 1.5 Billion people seems to me do be awfully dumb."

 

But collectively the West is not fighting 1.5 billion, just a small fraction of a percentage. The problem is that the 1.5 billion adherents of Islam seem to carry little weight in identifying the extremists and exterminating them.

 

You wrote

 

"One of two things is going to happen in the next 100(?) years. Islam will come to grips with the modern world change it fit in leave the desert behind or it will go away, become like the neo pagans are today."

 

Since WW II, radical elements among Islam appear to be doing nothing else than going into a higher boil. What evidence do you see that Islam is changing: a sea change or even moderation?

[Valin]

@Valin @SrWoodchuck

 

 

 

But collectively the West is not fighting 1.5 billion, just a small fraction of a percentage. The problem is that the 1.5 billion adherents of Islam seem to carry little weight in identifying the extremists and exterminating them.

A. You might be surprised at what goes on. The problem is it doesn't get covered. Small example (from the top of my head0, a couple of years ago a Terrorist was arrested in Indonesian, and put in jail. A mob broke into the jail took him out and hung from the nearest tree. Also Egypt/Turkey are not the only places we see huge anti Islamist demonstrations, Bangladesh & Malaysia huge protest. These thing never make the media here. So on the Right we don't see a lot of push back from what Spencer etal are putting out. I used to do it a lot at TOS, but got tired of fighting the (willful) ignorance of people there. I say willful because by this point people should know better.

 

You wrote

 

"One of two things is going to happen in the next 100(?) years. Islam will come to grips with the modern world change it fit in leave the desert behind or it will go away, become like the neo pagans are today."

 

Since WW II, radical elements among Islam appear to be doing nothing else than going into a higher boil. What evidence do you see that Islam is changing: a sea change or even moderation?

See Reply 12.

[NCTexan]

We have a lot of "open microphones" available to anyone who will step up to speak here in this country.

 

I don't remember hearing much of a peep from the "Silent Muslim Majority" after any of the "In the name of Islam" terrorists events... and I'm talking both local and national.

 

Yes, Fox can find the same one or two consultants to routinely drag on their shows for a couple of days after each tragedy.

 

Other than that, if anything is said... it's usually a defense of the perpetrators or squawks about how unfair the Muslim community is being treated.

 

When was the last Silent Muslim Majority March Against Terror?

 

I fully recognize that a small percentage of their population is actually directly involved in the "mischief"... but in this case, I feel that silence means consent... or at least acceptance.

 

Just my opinion.

 

 

 

[Geee]

Your silence gives consent - Plato.

[SrWoodchuck]

What? You're not an Islamophobe? Why in heaven's name not?

http://curmudgeonlyskeptical.blogspot.com/search/label/What%3F%20%20You%27re%20not%20an%20Islamophobe%3F%20%20Why%20in%20heaven%27s%20name%20not%3F

 

I think you have to look at several things pertaining to Islam. Not what they say....I mean they already admit that it's OK to lie to an infidel. What are their actions?

 

In countries where they have control/Sharia law:

 

British woman 'arrested in Dubai after being raped' http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/dubai/6949008/British-woman-arrested-in-Dubai-after-being-raped.html

 

Woman charged with illicit sex after rape claim ‘pardoned’ by Dubai [Norwegian woman this time] http://www.thestar.com/news/world/2013/07/22/woman_charged_with_illicit_sex_after_rape_claim_pardoned_by_dubai.html

 

Emirati woman arrested for being raped [Emirati woman this time] http://thegulfblog.com/2010/05/18/emirati-woman-arrested-for-being-raped/

 

Armenian Christians and Turkish Muslims: Atrocity, Denial and Identity http://www4.samford.edu/lillyhumanrights/papers/VanGorder_Armenian.pdf

 

Friday, May 20, 2005
Islam - Muslim Crimes:

 

The Bamiyan Buddhas were among the most impressive Buddhist monuments in central Asia before their demolition in March 2001 at the hands of the Taliban http://www.orientalarchitecture.com/afghanistan/statewide/bamiyan.php

 

Muslim Attacks on Christians in Egypt Part of “Jihad” Plan http://www.persecution.org/2013/06/13/muslim-attacks-on-christians-in-egypt-part-of-jihad-plan/

 

Muslim Mobs Kill Egyptian Christians in Wake of Morsi Ouster http://www.thenewamerican.com/world-news/africa/item/15951-muslim-mobs-kill-egyptian-christians-in-wake-of-morsi-ouster

 

Christians in Iran Sentenced for “Crimes Against The Islamic Order” http://www.persecution.org/2011/03/14/christians-in-iran-sentenced-for-crimes-against-the-islamic-order/

 

Muslim Hate Crimes Against Christians in Somali Repeated Rapes of Mother and Daughter http://www.rightsidenews.com/2008121130747/world/terrorism/muslim-hate-crimes-against-christians-in-somali-repeated-rapes-of-mother-and-daughter.html

 

Muslim Attacks Against Christians http://socyberty.com/issues/muslim-attacks-against-christians/

 

Muslim mob torches Christian homes in Pakistan after reports man committed blasphemy http://life.nationalpost.com/2013/03/09/muslim-mob-torches-christian-homes-in-pakistan-after-reports-man-committed-blasphemy/

 

In Muslim countries.....I could go on for days posting, what about in countries where they aren't in total control?

 

Violence Against Christians Moves Nigeria to No. 7 on List of Terror-Affected Nations http://cnsnews.com/news/article/violence-against-christians-moves-nigeria-no-7-list-terror-affected-nations

 

Genocide against Civilian Nigerian Christians http://www.canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/20867

 

Muslim Child-Rape Gangs in Britain http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/3068/muslim-child-rape-gangs-britain

 

Britain: Islam’s “Rape Jihad” Against Children http://shariaunveiled.wordpress.com/2013/07/14/britain-islams-rape-jihad-against-children/

 

Germany: Religious Muslim youth more violent http://islamineurope.blogspot.com/2010/06/germany-religious-muslim-youth-more.html

 

Suspected Muslim polygamist charged with welfare fraud http://www.france24.com/en/20100609-suspected-muslim-polygamist-welfare-fraud-lies-hebbadj-burqa-france-crime

 

MUSLIM VIOLENCE IN EUROPE INCREASES SHARPLY: IS IT CRIME OR JIHAD? http://constitutionclub.org/2011/03/10/muslim-violence-in-europe-increases-sharply-is-it-crime-or-jihad/

 

Muslims on Riots in France http://www.nytimes.com/2005/11/13/weekinreview/13memri.excerpts.html?pagewanted=print&_r=0

 

Why we don’t call them “Muslim riots” in Paris suburbs http://blogs.reuters.com/faithworld/2007/11/29/why-we-dont-call-them-muslim-riots-in-paris-suburbs/

 

Paris suburbs erupt in violent protests over veil ban http://www.rawstory.com/rs/2013/07/23/paris-suburbs-erupt-in-violent-protests-over-veil-ban/

 

Italian Mafia & Muslim Terrorists Join Forces http://bitterqueen.typepad.com/friends_of_ours/2011/01/italian-mafia-muslim-terrorists-join-forces.html

 

45% of Belgian Prison Inmates Are Muslim http://islamversuseurope.blogspot.co.uk/2013/05/45-of-belgian-prison-inmates-are-muslim.html

 

Muslims in Italy tell those concerned over Christianophobia: Convert to Islam! http://www.speroforum.com/a/47098/Muslims-in-Italy-tell-those-concerned-over-Christianophobia-Convert-to-Islam#.UfAaQG0bhMs

 

Something Rotten in Denmark? by Daniel Pipes and Lars Hedegaard http://www.sullivan-county.com/id3/denmark.htm

 

Muslim Crime Wave in Canada http://dodocanspell.blogspot.com/2013/03/muslim-crime-wave-in-canada-part-xxxvi.html

 

The Living Hell For Swedish women: 5% Muslim Pop commit nearly 77.6% of all rape crimes http://themuslimissue.wordpress.com/2012/08/20/the-living-hell-for-swedish-women-5-muslims-commit-nearly-77-6-of-all-rape-crimes/

 

Swedish Welfare State Collapses as Immigrants Wage War http://www.brusselsjournal.com/node/938

 

Swedes Reach Muslim Breaking Point http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,139614,00.html

 

Muslim crime wave in Sydney http://www.australianislamistmonitor.org/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=3598

 

Muslim Immigrants Five Times More Likely to Commit Crimes than Australians http://frontpagemag.com/2012/dgreenfield/muslim-immigrants-five-times-more-likely-to-commit-crimes-than-australians/

 

Okay........I don't have enough time left on earth to post all the things that go wrong in the name of Islam.

 

Your opinion, @Valin, is worth as much as mine....or anybody else here @ TRR.

 

It is my opinion that your intellectual, elitist & narrow view of Islam is dangerous naivete......something that will continue to result in pain & suffering for whole populations, until they understand that the welcome mat of Immigration Jihad is being used....along with Rape Jihad & plain old fashioned butchery....to bring about the submission that they intend....and that even the name of their religion means.

 

I'm open to them proving me wrong....but 13 centuries of proven action hasn't changed them.

 

Do they have a right to practice their religion & enjoy liberty? Certainly....but their liberty stops at my door.....and I reserve the right to bitch about their destruction of the American Republic from within....one of their stated goals, BTW.

[Pepper]

@SrWoodchuck

 

"Do they have a right to practice their religion & enjoy liberty? Certainly....but their liberty stops at my door.....and I reserve the right to bitch about their destruction of the American Republic from within....one of their stated goals, BTW."

 

Bump to that.

 

I think part of the problem is the definition of Islam, for some it is only a religion and way to live, but for others it is totalitarianism and subjugation or destruction of non-Islamists wrapped in a kandorah or a burqa

[SrWoodchuck]

......oh and of course Obama is a secret Muslim.....

 

 

Who do you believe.....me.....or your lyin' eyes?

 

Of course he wasn't born to a Muslim father....and raised in Indonesia, taking the name of his Muslim step-father...and commenting that he loves the Muslim call to prayer........and was put through college as a Muslim Indonesian exchange student...and had his college years paid for by Saudi billionaires....and traveled to Pakistan on his Muslim passport and has MuslimBrotherhoods entwined in his administration....and supports every Arab springer that can spout "Aloha Snackbar" and... isn't a Muslim.

 

He's a Muslim sympathizer & abettor...

 

Obama Halts Delivery Of F-16s To Egypt Over Military’s Sacking Of Morsi… http://weaselzippers.us/2013/07/24/obama-halts-delivery-of-f-16s-to-egypt-over-militarys-sacking-of-morsi/

 

US President Barack Obama has taken a personal decision to suspend the delivery of F-16 fighter jets to Egypt, claiming it is no longer “appropriate” following the toppling Mohamed Morsi’s government.

 

“Given the current situation in Egypt, we do not believe it is appropriate to move forward at this time with the delivery of F-16s,” Pentagon spokesman George Little said in a statement.

 

 

Via WeaselZippers

[Pepper]

@SrWoodchuck

 

"US President Barack Obama has taken a personal decision"

 

one of the few many times he has taken a personal decision

 

interjecting himself in every race based incident (Professor Henry Louis Gates and the police; Zimmerman), making personal decisions to divide the population by class and race, and making the personal decision to stand at a far distance from the things that really counts: Benghazi, IRS, NSA spying

 

 

Edited

 

Here's Zero and another political personal decision:

 

Obama: Rest of my presidency is for working-class America

Edited July 24, 2013 by Pepper

[NCTexan]

@SrWoodchuck

 

"US President Barack Obama has taken a personal decision"

 

one of the few many times he has taken a personal decision

 

interjecting himself in every race based incident (Professor Henry Louis Gates and the police; Zimmerman), making personal decisions to divide the population by class and race, and making the personal decision to stand at a far distance from the things that really counts: Benghazi, IRS, NSA spying

 

 

Edited

 

Here's Zero and another political personal decision:

 

Obama: Rest of my presidency is for working-class America

 

In the pyscho-babble world of Liberalism which Zero lives.... "Working Class Americans" generally means people who have never worked.... including their progenitors for several generations back.

 

Word switching and program naming is key to his political shell games.

 

I'm sure that it's justified in his mind with his Rev. Wright world view.... "They would have been working if "The Man" hadn't held them down and denied them the right to succeed."

[Pepper]

@NCTexan

 

Agree

[SrWoodchuck]

"Working Class Americans" generally means people who have never worked....

 

@NCTexan & @Pepper! They are a class of American's that could be working.......but...why....when other Americans can pay for everything?

[Valin]

What? You're not an Islamophobe? Why in heaven's name not?

http://curmudgeonlyskeptical.blogspot.com/search/label/What%3F%20%20You're%20not%20an%20Islamophobe%3F%20%20Why%20in%20heaven's%20name%20not%3F

 

I think you have to look at several things pertaining to Islam. Not what they say....I mean they already admit that it's OK to lie to an infidel.

Actually that would be no, Assuming you are talking about taqiyya As it is used by Islamist today, it is a very recent development. Not taqiyya its self that goes back to the Sunnie/Shia divide. What is interesting is it started by Shia to hige who they were and protect themselves from Sunni persecution. I 1st ran across it shortly after 9-11 (Before that day I like so many, knew zip zero about Islam, the history of the region) I was put out by a Norwegian (?) was picked up by Robert Spencer, Andrew Bostom...etc. As is my habit did some research Bernard Lewis mentioned it in his "The Middle East a brief history of the last 2,000 years" and as I recall what he said agreed with the above link. Now (alas) it's all over the internet.

 

Okay........I don't have enough time left on earth to post all the things that go wrong in the name of Islam.

Yes you could, and it would not refute my thesis one bit. I have never said there are not huge major serious problems with Islam. I have very little use for the Esposito's of this world, and I have absolutely no use for CAIR...etc. My point is contrary to what Spencer and others say, it is not by any means the Whole Story. Also contrary to what people like Esposito and The Middle East Studies Association (a wholly owned subsidiary of our "Good Friends" The Saudis) My thesis can be found in Daniel Pipes writings. What do these clowns (the Islamists...particularly the violent ones) say? They say We (non Muslims) are at war with them and want to destroy their religion. So every time some one shouts out Nuke Mecca...F the rag heads, they use this to show that we are at war with them....all Muslims.

 

http://vimeo.com/43342122

[Valin]

@SrWoodchuck

 

Additionally if you want to talk history, we can do that also. We can discuss Charlemagne and his conversion of the Saxons, He'd come in with his army kick the crap out of them, then tell them that had a choice, convert or die. We can move on to the various crusades against heresies in the middle ages, John Huss come to mind he might have been successful except he pissed off the local princes, and so....We could also look at The 1st Crusade and the Jew at Mainz, or for that matter both the Jews and Muslims when Jerusalem fell, the 30 years war...Bloody Mary...I could go on. Let's just say the history of the Church is not exactly a tea party. Point is we (hopefully) learned, and are still learning. And this is what is happening inside Islam.

 

History...its not just for breakfast anymore.